Novi postaji Kenwood TS-590S in TH7D72

[S58T]

Prvi vtisi o TS-590S v S5 so: izredna postaja, neverjetno kaj vse je Kenwoodu uspelo spraviti v te dimenzije!
Sprejemnik je res izreden, primerjalni testi z IC-775DSP, FT-1000MIV in TS-850 na isti mizi glede na fazni šum so prav fantastični.
Postaja na področjih z down konverzijo primerjalno praktično ne generira faznega šuma, kar ima za posledico izredno čisto oddajo in sprejem, izredno modulacijo na sprejemu in oddaji.
Za SO 2R ali multi kategorije so praktično postavljena nova merila.
Si moram izposodit Javornik, menim, da je TS-590S prva idealna postaja zanj!
Digitalna AGC je tudi izredna, fading na sprejemu je drastično zmanjšan.
Postaja je povrhu vsega zasnovana tako, da je delo z njo skrajno enostavno in učinkovito.
Kenwoodova filozofija, da za kvaliteto velikost ohišja ni merilo, je prišla s to postajo res do izraza.

Kenwood je ponovno omogočil brezplačen software za remote delo, ki postaja ob vseh restrikcijah v urbanem okolju čedalje bolj aktualna zadeva.

Kenwood je v enem izmed svojih biltenov napisal, da je TS-590S logičen korak v njihovem lastnem razvoju tehnologije in nikakor ni postaja mišljena kot 'killer' kakšnih drugih modelov.


Vabljeni na ogled in preizkus, ustvarite si lastno mnenje.

Miro S58T 040 520 888

[s55z]

Hojla, kdaj rabiš Javornika?

[S58T]

Dragan,

hvala za ponudbo,
potreboval bi ga za meritve takoj, vendar bom raje prej dokončal Slo navodila za TS-590S. Takoj zatem te poprosim...

Predvidoma konec naslednjega tedna , če je možno.
Ostalo po Skypu.

Miro S58T

[s52w]

Kljub temu, da verjamem številkam, ki kažejo na odličnost TS590 me zanima, če je kdo že delal kakšne primerjave s konkurenčnimi postajami drugih proizvajalcev. Predvsem me zanimajo primerjave z FT1000, FT2000, K3..., kako se postaja obnese v eksplozijah bandov v večjih KV tekmovanjih. Do zdaj sem slišal samo hvale, mene pa zanimajo tudi kritike .

73 Damjan S52W

[s58dx]

Kljub temu, da verjamem številkam, ki kažejo na odličnost TS590 me zanima, če je kdo že delal kakšne primerjave s konkurenčnimi postajami drugih proizvajalcev. Predvsem me zanimajo primerjave z FT1000, FT2000, K3..., kako se postaja obnese v eksplozijah bandov v večjih KV tekmovanjih. Do zdaj sem slišal samo hvale, mene pa zanimajo tudi kritike .

73 Damjan S52W

Damjan,

poglej na http://www.eham.net , reviews od TS-590S, http://www.youtube.com ter se včlani v Yahoo groups za TS-590S.
Vsi odgovori na tvoja vprašanja so tam.

Lp Nermin S58DX

[s52w]

TNX INFO Nermin. Kritiko za TS590 je res težko najti. Še najbolj moteče je, da nima 2nd RX, ampak za 1560 € se mu tudi to oprosti .

73 Damjan S52W

[S59ZB]

TNX INFO Nermin. Kritiko za TS590 je res težko najti. Še najbolj moteče je, da nima 2nd RX, ampak za 1560 € se mu tudi to oprosti .

73 Damjan S52W

Nakaj kritike se pa vseeno najde, npr. N3AYY: "Really Nice Radio, But Did Not Like for SSB Contesting".

73 Zvone, S59ZB

[s58dx]

Damjan, Zvone,

najboljša ilustracija "za kaj se gre " so copy sporočila iz Yahoo reflectorja od danes:

That is a big truth, Ken.
No matter how good the TS590S is, and we do not doubt it is, it is clear that it lacks the features of radios 3 o more times more expensive.
The new Kenwood just puts quality and reasonably high specifications available for more people, that cannot, or do not want to, pay that much money.
Cheers to you-all,
José


2010/12/13 keng4kir <K.Chattenton@btopenworld.com>



HI from Ken, G4KIR,

Lets put it this way, If I bought the 'ICOM-7800' I would expect a lot better IP2, IP3 figures for a start.
What you get in the 'TS590S' is a lot of radio, but lets not loose sight of the price difference.
The 'K3' is three times the price of the 'TS590S' here in the UK, but we keep getting comparisons with that radio, and I just find it a little disconcerting folk forget the great value we have in the '590S' for it's price point.

Hope this clears up any trouble you may have had with my statement.........cheers, Ken, G4KIR.


----- Original Message -----
From: w2blc
To: KenwoodTS-590@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, December 13, 2010 11:46 AM
Subject: [KenwoodTS-590] Re: Rob Sherwood currently testing TS-590s



Why would you want to take price into account on a lab review of a rig?


Če pa nekdo želi imeti "diversity reception" naj kupi DVA TS-590S in jih
poveže. Miro mu bo lahko pomagal

Drugač je pa to že ispeljal, Tom W8JI z DRAKE R4C,

Lep pozdrav vsem, let it be Kenwood!

Nermin S58DX

[s58dx]

Ekola ,

prve preliminarne meritve Kenwood TS-590S z strani
Sherwood engineeringa:
==========================================================
Hello All,

Rob was kind enough to send me the following information in an email a few minutes ago.
The numbers are NOT FINAL TEST RESULTS - He still has a lot of testing to do before he puts the radio in his receiver test list.
While Rob lists the radios in order of Dynamic Range (Narrow Spaced) - There is of course more to a radio than JUST Dynamic Range!
It is important to remember he could have just as easily listed the radios in order of weight, size of VFO knob, or any other category.
For the average user who wants to get on air and have a chat and do a bit of DX...
there is probably very little discernible difference between the top 10 or 20 or even 30 radios on his list in reality.
While numbers tell one story - it is of course up to the user if a particular radio suits you or not.
Unless you're a serious contester - the numbers are interesting but not a sole reason to chose a particular radio in most cases.
Again, I stress these numbers are initial test results and are, I quote Rob... 'a work in progress'...
If he sends me anything else I'll let you all know in this thread.
73,
Craig - VK3VCM


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sherwood Engineering HF Test Results
Model TS-590S Serial # B0A00386 Test Date: 12/15/2010

IF BW 2400 –6 / -60, Hz 2510/3590 Ultimate 100* dB
IF BW 500 –6 /-60, Hz 490/977 Ultimate 92* dB
* Phase noise limited, 2 to 4 filter bandwidths away
Front End Selectivity (A – F) B
First IF rejection 11374 kHz 77 dB
Image rejection 2x24 kHz 90 dB
Dynamic Range, no preamp, 20 meters (down conversion)
Dynamic Range 20 kHz 104#dB IP3 +28 dBm
Dynamic Range 5 kHz 97# dB IP3 +18 dBm
Dynamic Range 2 kHz 88* dB IP3 +4 dBm
Dynamic Range 1 kHz 85* dB IP3 0 dBm
# Combination of phase noise and 3rd order product
* Phase noise limited
Dynamic Range, alternate conversion scheme, 17 meters (up conversion)
Dynamic Range 20 kHz 102 dB IP3 +21 dBm
Dynamic Range 2 kHz 76* dB IP3 -18 dBm
* Phase noise limited
Blocking above noise floor, 1uV signal @ 99 kHz, AGC On, 3 Hz filter 144^ dB
Blocking above noise floor, 1uV signal @ 99 kHz, AGC On, 3 Hz filter 133^^ dB
^ 20 meters (down conversion)
^^ 17 meters (up conversion)
Phase noise (normalized) at 2.5 kHz spacing: 118 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 5 kHz spacing: 130 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 10 kHz spacing: 140 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 20 kHz spacing: 144 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 40 kHz spacing: 146 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 80 kHz spacing: 147 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 100 kHz spacing: 147 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 200 kHz spacing: 147 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 300 kHz spacing: 148 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 400 kHz spacing: 148 dBc
Phase noise (normalized) at 500 kHz spacing: 148 dBc
Noise floor, SSB bandwidth 14.2 MHz, no preamp -125 dBm
Noise floor, SSB bandwidth 14.2 MHz, Preamp 1 On -133 dBm
Sensitivity at 14.2 MHz, no preamp 0.43 uV
Sensitivity at 14.2 MHz, Preamp 1 On 0.15 uV
Noise floor, 500 Hz, 14.2 MHz, no preamp -128 dBm
Noise floor, 500 Hz, 14.2 MHz, Preamp 1 On -137 dBm
Noise floor, SSB bandwidth 18.1 MHz, no preamp -127 dBm
Noise floor, SSB bandwidth 18.1 MHz, Preamp 1 On -134 dBm
Sensitivity at 18.1 MHz, no preamp 0.28 uV
Sensitivity at 18.1 MHz, Preamp 1 On 0.13 uV
Noise floor, 500 Hz, 18.1 MHz, no preamp -132 dBm
Noise floor, 500 Hz, 18.1 MHz, Preamp 1 On -139 dBm
Noise floor, SSB, 50.125 MHz, no preamp -126 dBm
Noise floor, SSB, 50.125 MHz, Preamp 1 -137 dBm
Sensitivity at 50.125 MHz, no preamp 0.35 uV
Sensitivity at 50.125 MHz, Preamp 1 On 0.10 uV
Noise floor, 500 Hz, 50.125 MHz, no preamp -130 dBm
Noise floor, 500 Hz, 50.125 MHz, Preamp 1 On -142 dBm
Signal for S9, no preamp 53 uV
Signal for S9, Preamp 1 15 uV
Gain of preamp 11 dB
AGC threshold at 3 dB, no preamp 20 meters (down conversion) 1.8 uV
AGC threshold at 3 dB, Preamp 1 On 20 meters (down conversion) 0.5 uV
AGC threshold at 3 dB, no preamp, 17 meters (up conversion) 1.4 uV
AGC threshold at 3 dB, Preamp 1 On, 17 meters (up conversion) 0.42 uV
Notes:
The TS-590S was used in the December 2010 ARRL 10 meter CW and SSB contest.
Signals were not not really strong until Sunday afternoon for a sporadic E opening when some signals exceeded S9 + 30 dB.
While the signal density between 28,350 and 28, 510 kHz was not as bad as CQ WW SSB, there were lots of signals and many that were splattering.
There was no indication that the receiver was ever in overload, even with the preamp ON.
Unfortunately I did not use it on CW during the E opening.
The transceiver will be used during the W1BB 160 meter CW contest in December.
ALC:
There is a significant ALC overshoot problem, that affects both CW and SSB when driving a linear.
The overshoot approaches as much as 20%.
This can either clip the amp when starting to talk after a slight pause, or saturate on the first "dit" on CW, possibly causing a key click on the air.
Transmit IMD:
The SSB signal was observed by W6XX with a K3 and LP-PAN during a 3 minute transmission, with the LP-PAN on Max Peak Hold.
Intermodulation "shoulders" were clearly visible on 20 meters, down approximately 25 dB. The S/N ratio at that time was 50 dB. Two tone tests will be run in lab at a later time.
Ergonomics:
Ergonomics are generally good, with a nice feel to the main tuning knob.
Many functions, however, need three actions to adjust: push a button, turn the multi-function knob, and then push the same button again to cancel the function.
The LCD S meter is easy to read and has enough granularity to reasonable approximate an analog meter.
EQ:
The EQ granularity is not adequate. One can treble boost 1 or 2 as an option or bass boost 1 or 2, but not both.
This is significantly less flexible than the K3 with its parametric 8-band equalize, which can boost or cut any of the eight bands.
The 590S worked fine with N1MM logger and the serial port when N1MM was configured as a TS-2000.
The serial port sex is backwards, just like the Yaesu products, requiring a "gender bender". No attempt to use the USB port was made, due to lack of time and likely lack of support as of December 2010 by N1MM.
The receive audio was quite pleasing via an external Icom SP-20 speaker, or Radio Shack headphones.
The size of the Kenwood is similar to an Elecraft K3 or a Ten-Tec Eagle.
The Eagle and the K3 significantly exceed the close-in dyanmic range on the bands where the 590S is in "up conversion" mode. If the K3 isn't filled with options, all three radios are in a similar price range.
The Kenwood is significantly heavier than the other two, and unlikely to move around while one is pushing buttons.

Rev 1b
====================
Lp nermin S58DX

[s58dx]

Pozdravljeni ,

glih prispelo na Yahoo reflektor, povzetek meritev iz RADCOM (RSGB):
====================================================

Just got my copy of Radcome. The review is several pages long.

Most of it we already know but....

Sensitivity: Up conversion RX2 slightly more sensitive than down coversion RX1 with about 2-3dB higher gain in the receive path.
Receiver very sensitive, especially above 2MHz where pre-amp has extra 8dB of gain.
Sensitivity at LF is -123dBm@136kHz and only starts to reduce at 50kHz. Reduced by about 16dB over MW broadcast bands.

Rejection of IFs and images for RX1 down conversion typically 75-90dB. RX2 up conversion typically above 90dB.

DDS-suprious responses: RX2 very clean with no responses less than 80dB down.
RX1 exceptionally clean with no responses less than 100dB down except internally generated birdie on 1827.5kHz which won't be a problem on large antennas,
but would on receive only loops and beverages. Switching to RX2 by selecting bandwidth >2.7kHz makes the birdie disappear.

Flaming hell, there's going to be some worried people:

Close in intermod on CW with 500Hz bandwidth, pre-amp off
7 Mhz RX1 bandwidth to 500Hz
Spacing: 1kHz, TOI: +3.5dBm, 2 tone DR: 90dB
Spacing: 2kHz, TOI: +23dBm, 2 tone DR: 103dB

To put that into perspective (QST figures):
Elecraft K3 2009 model:
Spacing 2kHz, TOI: +26dBm, 2 tone DR: 103dB

So 2 tone Dynamic range on the TS-590 is actually better than the 2008 model Elecraft,
the Flex 300 and 5000, Icom 7600,7700,7800, Tentec Orion II and Omni IV, Yaesu FT2000, FT950, FTDx9000 etc etc etc.

In fact the only radio to beat it is the Yaesu FT5000 in the QST review figures.
If you look at Rob Sherwoods table, if it still tests equal to the K3, then there is no other radio to beat it other than the aforementioned Yaesu FTdx5000.

Boy am I glad I bought one. I knew it was better than my FT-950, you could hear it.

But I didn't realise it was this good.
------------------------------------

Ehh, ta kenwood

Lp Nermin S58DX

[S56CT]

Bob Bruninga, WB4APR, o APRS-u in novi TH D72:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pgn6RQGkcXg

in še primerjava VX 8GR in TH D72:

http://blog.g4ilo.com/2010/12/aprs-hand ... -head.html

[s58dx]

Pozdrav vsem ,

ekola v prilogi "LIVE" test Kenwood TS-590S vs.Yaesu FTDX-5000D.
Glede na to da ga je naredil NC0B Rob Sherwood, pravi guru za rcvx, bodite pozorni
na razlike in posebaj na "umazane" oddajnike obeh!!
=======================================================
Comparisons between the expensive FTdx-5000D and the reasonably-priced TS-590S.

As you can see below, I ran the Kenwood and Yaesu in this past weekend's CW contest. I also used the radios on SSB in the ARRL 10 meter contest and general rag chewing.

The 3X cost and weight differences are obvious.

Both performed well in the Stew Perry 160 meter contest which was not as crowded as the December ARRL 160 contest, but the band was packed from about 1802 to 1850 kHz. There was no sign of overload on either, which is what one would expect due to the good close-in dynamic range of both.

I used the 50 Hz filter bandwidth to work CE1/K7CA on both rigs between the two contest. The problem was all the stations calling the CE1, and having to be able to hear when the CE1 came back to me since other stations were still calling him while he answering a call. That required the 50 Hz bandwidth. Both rigs worked fine, though the ringing seemed a bit less on the Yaesu. That is a subjective call, but that what it seemed like. On this weekend I put both rigs on the CE1 for about 10 minutes, both on 50 Hz, and went back and forth with the operating position antenna switch to compare. The difference was subtle, but the sound of signals off the peak were less hollow sounding on the Yaesu. The bottom line was I was able to work the CE1 on the first call on both rigs once I got the signal tuned in on the 50 Hz filter.

I ran the attenuator on the 590S so the S meter was not reading on band noise. On the Yaesu I ran it on IPO1, which is has similar total gain as the Kenwood with the attenuator. To give more data, the S meter just starts to move on the 590S with the attenuator at 14 uV and the S meter just starts to move on the Yaesu on IPO1 at 11 uV. Both the values were perfect for me at my QTH out in the country.

I preferred the fact that the display on the Yaesu gave me the bandwidth I had selected all the time, while it goes away on the 590S, just like it goes away on the K3. This is a minor annoyance, but I prefer to know how I have the radio set without having to change it to see the bandwidth. I find that in a contest I try to vary to bandwidth and the IF shift (and the CW pitch) throughout the contest depending on QRM and to keep my ears from developing a notch at one frequency from listening for hours to the same beatnote.

Both rigs were setup for semi-break-in, the 590S driving an Alpha 99 and the 5000D driving an Alpha 89. Due to the limited bandwidth of my antenna on 160 meters, I have to adjust the drive level as I approach the low end and high end of the bottom 50 kHz to keep the reflected power to less than 250 watts. Otherwise the Alphas trip out on an SWR fault. This means I have to push a button, turn a knob and push a button on the 590S and to reach an inconvenient small concentric knob on the 5000D. Having to do three actions on the 590S was more cumbersome than turning the knob on the Yaesu.

The Yaesu had a 600 Hz roofing filter and the Kenwood the standard 500 Hz. Both radios were typically ran at 200 to 300 Hz bandwidth throughout the contest. The only problem I had with either radio was the key clicks / keying sidebands of a few strong stations. No radio can fix that problem, as it is the other stations problem of having poor wave shaping on transmit.

Both radios have transmit distortion problems on SSB under certain circumstances. W6XX has been taking screen shots with his K3 and LP-PAN of my signal of 20 meters on both rigs when I have a 50 dB S/N ratio. The 590S has obvious "shoulders" on the transmit signal that are worse than one would expect. I can supply this picture to anyone who wants to see it. The 5000D can be extremely clean, but only if one is running class A and running NO ALC and NO processing. Once the processor is turned on, and it only works if the ALC is really being driven, the 5000D seriously degrades from fantastic to mediocre. I also have screen shots of the 5000D. K7VO broke into a QSO Sunday to say he had never seen such a clean signal on the air with his K3 and P3 panadapter. That was with the 5000D running in class A with No processing and No ALC. This was with the 5000D driving the Alpha 89, so I guess that also means the pair of 3CX800s are pretty clean, too. Hit the processing and ALC to get Contest / DX pile-up talk power, and the clean Yaesu signal seriously degrades.

The 10 meter contest, where the 590S is a typical up-conversion radio, did not prove much. Signals were not that strong except for Sunday afternoon when there was a fantastic E skip opening to the east. Some signals were 30 to 40 over S9. There were several splattering signals at that time, just like there were on 20 meters during CW WW SSB. No radio can fix the problem of the other guy overdriving his linear or running with mic and processor "knobs maxed out". In general even up-conversion radios are adequate on SSB, since we have to contend with transmitted IMD products of the guy 3 kHz away. Those are generally worse than a radio's dynamic range, since most transceivers are 13.8 V. class B PAs with relatively poor IMD specs.

The main question will be how often a 590S will be stressed on 30 and 17 meters during a DXpedition pile-up like Peter 1.

I have not yet done lab transmit IMD test on the 590S. One ham noticed some phase noise issues with the 590S during the 10 meter contest when on CW. Measurements were made by me on 10 meters to look at that issue, and as a comparison a K3 will be measured this week. This was a case of local signals within line-of-sight causing problems when the offending station was very strong and 5 to 10 kHz away.

Phase noise is often a problem on Field Day, in a multi-transmitter contest station (even SO2R) and when you have close by neighbors. I see the close neighbor problem more often on 160 meters, but obviously this can happen on any band if you can climb up your tower and see other towers, even if a few miles away. That is one of the down sides of synthesized radios.

One more thing. I have to use the Kenwood more on 20 meters. I have been really annoyed by the click, tick and pop problem of the 5000D on SSB. Its AGC is really affected by any transient noise, which tends to push the S meter to S7. This can be electric equipment coming on, like a furnace, turning your rotor and having the brake energize or de-energize, a neighbor's electric fence, or just noises on the band that "pop". Most radios since 2003 have this problem. I and some other hams I know sold their IC-7800 due to this problem. I use my 781 or Pro III since they don't have the problem like the 7800. The 5000D certainly has the problem, while the K3 does not, nor do the Flex radios. So it can be fixed in firmware, if the programer knows how to tell the AGC to ignore an occasional 1 msec "pop". So far Yaesu, Icom and Ten-Tec have not figured this out.

73, Rob, NC0B



>>> Pavel Perchine <un7lg@yahoo.com> 12/20/2010 9:06 AM >>>

Hi,

Why not in our hobby?
K3 was a winner of many more expensive rigs.

Now, when there is a lot in DSP processing and a front-end with DDS is cheap to build I see that good quality transceiver can be made for a very low price.
Less than 1500 US.....easily.
TS-590 is a good example.

it's a technology, but marketing department still see the trend of a demand for an expensive radio
How much you can beat TS-590 by numbers? Not for another 3000 dollars I hope.

Pavel
VA6AM
===================
Nisem še kupil TS-590S. Čakam......

Lp Nermin S58DX

[S54O]

"Rudolf mi je privekel" TS590.
V shacku imam TRXe več proizvajalcev (Icom, Yaesu in Kenwood) in moja ocena ni niti strokovna niti navijaška.
Niti se nisem še utegnil poglobiti v vse menuje/nastavitve.
Je zgolj ocena po oddelanem RAEM cw tekmovanju in krajših testih:
= Nobenih "križnih"
= Normalno sprejemal tudi s 50Hz BW
= Notch zelo dober
= Izredno hiter AT
....

subjektivne opombe/primerjave:
- Modulacija ni »prava« = slabša kot na TS850
- RX (šum + filtracija): TS590 bi dal prednost pred FT2000

Zavedam se, da je to zelo parcialna ocena. Vendar me je postaja, navkljub odzivom in velikosti, vseeno prijetno presenetila.
Upam, da se najde tudi kakšna S5 kompetentna ocena.
Čez praznike imam sedaj dovolj dela
VY 73 de Boris S54O

[S58T]

Boris,

Glede na svoje glasovne značilnosti nastavi menija 25 in 26 (low in high TX cut), po želji pa še uporabi katero od 6 možnosti TX equalizerja v meniju 30.

Sam vedno pri vseh postajah uporabljam ožji pas (300-2400 Hz) in višji nivo procesorja.Tako redkeje dobim pohvale za izredno modulacijo, bolj uspešno pa pridem skozi v pileup-ih.

Postaja ima super 'Kenwood' modulacijo, postaje so sedaj vse tako narejene, da jih moraš malo prilagodit svojem grlu in tujim ušesom.

Moje izkušnje pri vsakodnevni uporabi:

Sprejem na ozkih CW filtrih je izredno udoben, audio pri sprejemanih SSB signalih pa je tako prijeten za poslušanje, da ponovno večkrat primem za mikrofon. Imam občutek, da bi bilo delo v SSB kontestu s to postajo manj utrujajoče za ušesa.

Pri TS-590S imam kot uporabnik eno samo manjšo pripombo:

Ročaj je samo eden, ob desnem boku. Če bi imela še enega na levem, bi bila tako za levičarje kot za desničarje. Rešitev prepuščam gurujem.

Vabim na ogled in preizkus delovanja.

Z veseljem predstavim tudi TS-480SAT, ki je glede na nižji cenovni razred pozitivno presenetila marsikoga. Mišljena kot druga postaja je že večkrat zasedla mesto glave postaje.

Miro S58T

[s51zg]

Sem že pomislil Miro, da boš rekel, če bi imela dva ročaja, da bi jo potem lažje dvignil z obema rokama...HI.

73 & HNY